Author Topic: They're talking about jitter......................  (Read 6211 times)

Gen. Dreedle

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Re: They're talking about jitter......................
« Reply #15 on: August 16, 2015, 10:34:43 AM »
Someone just told me about this one, over at that other place:

Quote
Besides Gerhard's warning about the difficulty to suppress the so-called "B"-mode, which is just 9% to 10% above the desired "C"-mode, there my be an issue if you operate an SC crystal without oven at room temperature. Because the frequency vs. temperature characteristic has a rather deep slope around RT, any minor temperature fluctuation will immediately translate into close-to-carrier phase noise and jitter. Thus the inherent advantage of an SC cut may be cancelled by this effect.

Right about the "B" mode.

Wrong about what happens at RT, wrt phase noise.

Yes, the frequency will change, if you look at it. It doesn't mess up the close-in phase noise. Somewhere I have some plots that prove this, but what do I know? I'm just some redneck in Texas.

There are some other things I can not  talk about. My associates are working on some things we are constrained by NDAs.

Maybe soon..............
"Major Danby, sir."
"Danby. D-A-N-B-Y."
"Take him out and shoot him."
"Sir?"
"I said take him out and shoot him. Can't you hear?"

MystereoN

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Re: They're talking about jitter......................
« Reply #16 on: August 16, 2015, 02:54:56 PM »
Keep up the good work, we are awaiting good news  :)
Never argue with a fool,
they will drag you down to their level,
then beat you with their experience!!!

Gen. Dreedle

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Re: They're talking about jitter......................
« Reply #17 on: August 19, 2015, 09:26:51 AM »
Word is some important folks are going to be here, on Thursday, to meet with the Ace Face.
"Major Danby, sir."
"Danby. D-A-N-B-Y."
"Take him out and shoot him."
"Sir?"
"I said take him out and shoot him. Can't you hear?"

Gen. Dreedle

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Re: They're talking about jitter......................
« Reply #18 on: December 28, 2015, 09:24:33 PM »
I see the usual "experts" are re-hashing the same ol' same ol', acting like they are at the cutting edge.

Hey, experts, I tried that 15 years ago, and it is NOT good enough.

But, it is a free country, and you are free to waste your own money and time, as you see fit. Just don't try to con us that you are on top of things.

And, yes, you really do need to measure below 1 Hz. And, yes, Allan Deviation would show the same stuff, more or less, but that doesn't mean you understand any of it.

Clearly, you do not.

Give up.
"Major Danby, sir."
"Danby. D-A-N-B-Y."
"Take him out and shoot him."
"Sir?"
"I said take him out and shoot him. Can't you hear?"

MystereoN

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Re: They're talking about jitter......................
« Reply #19 on: December 30, 2015, 11:55:04 AM »
DiyA thread from "testa dura" about master clock?
Never argue with a fool,
they will drag you down to their level,
then beat you with their experience!!!

Gen. Dreedle

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Re: They're talking about jitter......................
« Reply #20 on: January 08, 2016, 12:42:56 PM »
Si.
"Major Danby, sir."
"Danby. D-A-N-B-Y."
"Take him out and shoot him."
"Sir?"
"I said take him out and shoot him. Can't you hear?"

MystereoN

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Re: They're talking about jitter......................
« Reply #21 on: April 23, 2016, 03:00:32 AM »
I like older Dutch gentleman very much  :)
Never argue with a fool,
they will drag you down to their level,
then beat you with their experience!!!

MystereoN

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Re: They're talking about jitter......................
« Reply #22 on: July 14, 2016, 02:38:38 PM »
Nothing new on the DiyA, "experts" are still re-hashing the same ol' same ol' and presenting Epay POC as SOTA no-jitter design  :-\
LINK
Never argue with a fool,
they will drag you down to their level,
then beat you with their experience!!!

Gen. Dreedle

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Re: They're talking about jitter......................
« Reply #23 on: August 10, 2016, 06:47:08 AM »
Do me a favor, and see if you can get John W to contact me. I have his Skype number.............well, it was................it no longer works.

Anyway............they are talking about me, again!

Quote
Someone very known in the diy audio circle got -122dBc at 10 Hz from the carrier with a simple unbuffered '04 Pierce oscillator. He got this result using a 0.35 USD crystal strongly selected from a bag of them. Most of them were discarded because they performed very bad.

But they still won't listen. IDIOTS!

(You notice he did not specify the oscillation frequency, so that number doesn't really mean much. Idiot.)

(It was 11.2896 MHz, for those of you who are listening.)
"Major Danby, sir."
"Danby. D-A-N-B-Y."
"Take him out and shoot him."
"Sir?"
"I said take him out and shoot him. Can't you hear?"

Gen. Dreedle

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Re: They're talking about jitter......................
« Reply #24 on: August 10, 2016, 06:50:08 AM »
Quote
Did you make any measurements of the Crystek? Was listening your only means of determining performance?

Dear Misguided "Expert":

Don't know about that idiot, but "we" have done both. "We" have tons of data on them. "We" do not use them.

Does that answer your question?
"Major Danby, sir."
"Danby. D-A-N-B-Y."
"Take him out and shoot him."
"Sir?"
"I said take him out and shoot him. Can't you hear?"

Gen. Dreedle

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Re: They're talking about jitter......................
« Reply #25 on: August 10, 2016, 06:51:52 AM »
Quote
Have you measured a 24 MHz Crystek? Is there any reason to question their published performance?

Yes and yes.

Don't ask about 49 MHz.............................
"Major Danby, sir."
"Danby. D-A-N-B-Y."
"Take him out and shoot him."
"Sir?"
"I said take him out and shoot him. Can't you hear?"

MystereoN

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Re: They're talking about jitter......................
« Reply #26 on: August 12, 2016, 06:17:25 AM »
Do me a favor, and see if you can get John W to contact me. I have his Skype number.............well, it was................it no longer works.

Done.
Never argue with a fool,
they will drag you down to their level,
then beat you with their experience!!!

Gen. Dreedle

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Re: They're talking about jitter......................
« Reply #27 on: September 03, 2016, 11:40:30 AM »
Quote
I used to use a granite surface plate a pneumatic isolators for phono. Worked well for structure born vibration. But acoustical stuff needs addressing.

You can actively correct for vibration, kind of like a txco or actively suspend the oscillator. Both intersting but nontrivial projects.

What in the hell is this so-called expert rambling on about? He seems clueless.
"Major Danby, sir."
"Danby. D-A-N-B-Y."
"Take him out and shoot him."
"Sir?"
"I said take him out and shoot him. Can't you hear?"

Gen. Dreedle

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Re: They're talking about jitter......................
« Reply #28 on: September 03, 2016, 11:43:46 AM »
Now, here is a guy who obviously NOT clueless. Probably because he actually works with RF, instead of just pretending RF is just some funny kind of audio, and all the same crap applies.

Quote
That is so typical for audio, that one of the minor aspects is singled out,
blown up beyond any proportion and that is then the benchmark in a
community. Be it FETs, use of iron in boxes, but in transformers it is ok,
but ferrite is bad again. OMG.

I can assure you that granite does not play a role in commercial oscillator design,
and a good oscillator can deliver stellar performance, just sitting on a lab table
but shielded from moving air.

Vibration sensitivity is a problem when you build a radar for a helicopter
where a crystal is multiplied up to 10 GHz and you get Doppler echoes from
slowly moving targets that are just 5 Hz off the transmitted carrier.

Anyone notice the most important line???

He gets it. The rest of that crowd..............especially the "experts"............clearly do not.
"Major Danby, sir."
"Danby. D-A-N-B-Y."
"Take him out and shoot him."
"Sir?"
"I said take him out and shoot him. Can't you hear?"

Gen. Dreedle

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Re: They're talking about jitter......................
« Reply #29 on: September 03, 2016, 11:49:03 AM »
Quote
It would be interesting to see what performance can be had using a Potato gate in a gate oscillator.

No, it wouldn't................you..........you...................you "expert".

Will someone please tell this guy to shut up, before he embarrasses himself, any more.

Wait, on second thought:

No, go ahead, show your ignorance. Maybe, just maybe, some of the outfits that throw money at you, for "consulting", will throw some money at some of the folks that I know. In which case, in some obtuse and circumlocutory manner, a pittance benefits might fall in my direction.

Unbelievable.....................
"Major Danby, sir."
"Danby. D-A-N-B-Y."
"Take him out and shoot him."
"Sir?"
"I said take him out and shoot him. Can't you hear?"